Octatrack vs. Deluge and why I chose neither

My approach is pick one and get good at it. Then you'll start making music and stop re-learning new machines every time imo

this video is Pre- Open source announcement for Deluge (Superbooth, mai 2023). so that's something to consider. all the complaints regarding the Deluge could be addressed at some point..

Never had a Deluge, so I'm taking your word for it, but I completely agree with your view on the Octatrack. It was the first ever Elektron device I had. Sure, after some struggling I could get it to perform some basic things, but I never committed to it as much as the wizards have. Went down the classic route: got frustrated, sold it. But I kept seeing these awesome Elektron jams people have been putting out, so I figured it must be me and the not the machines. So I bought the Model:Samples/Cycles and had lots of fun with them, but quickly noticed some severe shortcomings. So I went for the Digitakt and finally took off: I made music instead of reading manuals. That felt great and I wanted more, so I got the Digitone, the Analog Four and recently the Syntakt. The Elektron workflow has a few shortcomings of its own, but I've reached a point where I can comfortably operate all the Elektron boxes I own and get to some arguably pleasing results relatively quickly. Sure, I can get super nice tones out of various synths, but I'll end up not using them for music because recording them for a track in the pc is an absolute inspiration killer for me because I'll once again be troubleshooting instead of making music. Therefore I agree with your conclusion as well: you may not be the groovebox guy, but I very much am. I'd love to be a DAW guy too just like you, but so far it's simply been too frustrating because every single time I fire up the DAW I have to troubleshoot something. Every time! Life's too short and filled with time consuming and unfortunately often not so meaningful work anyway, so let's both just keep on making music for a while before we seek out new gear ;)

I've watched tons of videos about octatrack, digitakt, deluge and all that modern DAWless stuff, but one thing still concerns me - why these mostly are tutorial and review videos, and no real performances at all? The only groove box that has more performances than reviews is electribe esx.

I do with daws what you do with grooveboxes: I download a trial version, quickly realize that I don’t like the endless complexity of it, don’t touch it for several weeks and then forget the basic things I could do in that daw and then return to my grooveboxes, which I use so regularly I can memorize the functions much better…..

My odyssey of 15 years to find the right setup for me: started with a Roland MC 505, loved the workflow but bulky and too many limitations, then NI Maschine, went on to Ableton Push 2, didnt like the use of a DAW, decided to go DAWless, bought a Roland MC 909, resold it, got the new MC 707, classic early buyer, software was not ready and too limited, sold it, got a 1010music blackbox, liked it but for sampling only and finally got a Deluge 2 years ago: Gamechanger for me. DAWless, super easy MIDI controlling of my synths, 6h hours battery (love it for being outdoors), the internal synth and effects are bread and butter but it‘s surprising how good tracks sound that only used internal sounds. Super happy with my Deluge. I played an Octatrack for a few hours and was immediately put off by it‘s illogical workflow

Deluge is getting an lcd, AND you can retrofit your existing deluge by buying just the lcd. Pretty sure we'll be able to name individual sequences. PS. Deluge price is going up a la Rytm.

Just stumbled on this video dude, we are so similar haha. I've bought the Deluge and Digitakt and Digitone only to realize I just don't really love grooveboxes over and over again. The freedom and fluidity of a daw is just too great. I will say though I've been loving the Polyend Play (just did a video) because of how utterly wild and random it gets; I think you'd have a ton of fun with that!

I tried MPC because of Octatracks learning curve, but after beeing frustrated enough, i am back on the Octatrack, you just have to put the effort in, its rewarding.

I tried the Push2 (Ableton) for a short while till I discovered I was being forced into boxes, either of time signatures I needed always to fight to get away from eighths and sixteenths, or of scales… It was fun for a while. But I sold it, without regrets. I also tried DAWs, but they were too much like my day-job: too “computer-y”, capturing midi, and then tweaking the piano-roll to correct my mistakes. (Didn’t enjoy that much because of the unlimited possibilities.) So now I am happier just playing the keyboards on the synths, and working with the limits of making whole music with just my fingers and only doing modulation that I can physically reach during live play. I think I now need to re-embrace the DAW, with more discipline, and clarity over the limitations I need to apply, to free me for a level of live improvisation over stuff that I could get the DAW to replicate for me, or assist me with. Ultimately the best machine I use to play with, is essentially just a metronome, to keep my pace up.

Great reviews! I have decided to avoid these seq/sample boxes in general for exactly the reasons you pointed out… Attempting to wrap my head around these is daunting. I made an attempt at the octatrack and decided that “Control-Alt Shift” removed all creative inspiration from my mind… Sticking with my feeble workstation hardware sequencer or Pro Tools.

One big difference which makes me choose the Deluge is that it is open source. The community has made many features that we have asked for

@06:38 Definitively! It is good to hear that... I also really wanted to like the groove boxes..... maybe not for me 😢 . What I did is to have many MIDI controllers that I use along with Cubase and have a very cool experience creating, almost DAW-less because I don't need to dive into the DAW, almost all parameteres I need, I can controll with physical knobs and keys without even having to look at the DAW.... Cubase is the best one to do that; you take almost any midi controller and in minutes you make it work exactly as you want, forget Mackie controller templetes.... this is ad hoc and super easy

Man that old octatrack looks sweet! I didn't even know anything like that existed 10 years ago or I would have been pining for it haha. I spend most of my time in my DAW too, but when I have time to step away from it and do something just for fun, it's straight to groovebox, guitar, or keys 🎶

The current only groove box that I think would capture my fancy is the Polyend Play due to its probablistic features and the ease of having varied length and speed tracks. Obviously, it is massively lacking in the sampling side of things, but I honestly don't mind the idea of just loading it with a curated set of sounds that interest me and going from there. As someone who also thinks less in loops, it seems free form enough to fit what I want from a groove box well.

Me too! I have a Circuit Tracks and after more than a year, it does not click with me. I am a DAW guy. I have used traditional sequencers…to stream notes into my DAW.

I share so many of your views on the OctaTrack: suffering daily to get my head around the clumsy sampling features, routing, tracks and such, I eventually spent time on the web finding solutions, rather than making music. And about GRAS, yes, it happens, but why feel bad about it? I may have a more severe form of GRAS: whenever I have gear that I "really" dig, well, I buy a second one. But I never re-bought gear that I previously sold.

Spot on, Mr. Jones. There is no best way except the way that works best for you. And whether that's DAWless or inside the box makes no difference. Personally, I've never used one of these groovebox/sampler/sequencer machines - and even when I watch reviews/tutorials of these things (and I've watched loads) I still never feel the need to try one out. I'm so comfortable with my current workflow (Studio One) that I don't see any reason to "fix" what ain't broken! But anyone who feels that DAWless is best for them, I applaud you.

Maschine+ had all answers for me! It’s so good …… with my acute GRAS , it only took the second buy to keep it :)

Did you replace them with a different sampler? I had the MPC One. I own the MPC Live II. I hate them both! My favorite sampler is the Circuit Rhythm but it has to many limitations. I like the immediate controls of the Circuit Rhythm and I find I gravitate towards instruments with less menu diving. Any suggestions for a sampler with immediate controls and some cool features?