Can Marriage DIVORCE Patriarchy?

Aromanticism being acknowledged so casually, not even mistaking it for asexuality or as a side branch of ace, hits like an incredibly pleasant truck. Foreign really knows his stuff and it's amazing to feel seen and understood like that. Thank you!

I think this will boil down simply. The institution of marriage and our idea of what a marriage is will not survive being divorced from patriarchy, but the concept of a union between two or more peoples showing their commitment to building a future together can be completely divorced from patriarchy.

*screams in Relationship anarchy *

So my wife recently talked me into finally watching "It's a Wonderful Life" and the conversation about how any other accomplishments a woman achieves are often seen as secondary to her getting married reminded of a scene from that movie. When the protagonist sees what the world would look like if he were never born, he immediately learns that one of his friends accidentally poisoned a child, went to prison for 20 years, and is now a homeless drug addict. Another's family left him and he, like most of the town, now lives in poverty in one of its many slums. His brother died at 9 years old because he wasn't there to help him when he fell through the ice on a frozen lake. Then, after this litany of death, destruction, and broken lives, he asks the angel what happened to his wife, and this is what finally breaks him. Wait for it. You might want to sit down...... She never got married and works at the library. This is the thing that finally makes him crack. Even the angel is like "Ooh, I'm not sure you want to see this." while they are literally standing on top of his brother's grave. It was so weird to see the progression of events as 1) a guy who he helped has now had his life destroyed 2) his best friend had his life destroyed 3) his brother died 4) his wife...is fine...but didn't marry someone else, and consider that when this film was released, this was a completely rational build up. To the audience that saw this in theatres, the final straw really was the worst of them. The gasps of horror really did get louder every time. There was nothing funny or anti-climactic at all, and, while this is a funny idea today, the core tendencies behind it are definitely still strong in our society. I've definitely met women who actually antagonize over not being married in a way that calls to mind the same horror of George Bailey at the fate of his wife.

“I fear the gender roles we rehearse may be the hearse for our love” Goddamn that’s a bar. I proposed to my wife because it’s what we wanted, but this is an equal partnership in love. We haven’t had nor intend to anytime soon have a ceremony cause it’s not what either of us want right now. I try and she tries to never let what we have been told is our role make us puppets acting against what we would otherwise choose. But so many people will make that harder

Do you know how happy I am that the girlies are getting into RA??? I am so excited to check out that YouTube channel as well. Okey…Imma stop high commenting cause I’ve left like 4 lol

I felt so very seen by the anecdote about "not taking time to be disappointed because no one would care." It's so ingrained in us that even if we make constant conscious efforts to reject our own patriarchal impulses, these habitual responses persist. Not feeling like we have a right to acknowledge our emotional responses, and always cutting them off before they can run their course; it's like suicide by 1000 cuts.

The lady with the red hair hit it on the nose about romance being transactional in our culture. It goes beyond toxic masculinity; it’s core to our culture. It’s what creates “nice guys” and “queens” and why we seem to lack emotional skills in an egalitarian society. People are not number generators. It’s a problem we need to root out and build a better foundation to replace it

LOOOOL the way you crept bell in there!! Yes. Yeeeessssss. Yessssssssssssssssesssss 💕💕💕

As a poly person, no we don't always get away from the bull, but the one true rule I think applies to all relationships, communicate, often and repeatedly until you are sure your partner understands. I would offer that advice, if you have these concerns talk it out, until your both sick of it, and do it again on a regular basis until you both have a crystal clear idea of what you want, need and desire, trust me it can suck, and some relationships crumble from it, but here's the secret, if communication destroys a relationship it was doomed to begin with.

I just stopped by to say scrolling by and seeing this thumbnail made me think this was someone’s Sims stream 😂

Yeah theres a lot of "traditional patriarchal roleplay" expected out of some same gender relationships. As one of them NB Colored folks, I am never able to conform to such an expectation, and I've had to break off several relationships because of it. I've been thinking about Marriage as a concept and I really only believe it would serve me as far as it's institutional benifits go. I'd rather have a relationship based on a lot of mutual emotions, goals, and support without marriage. I always say that I want teammates, but I'm also polyamorous because one person would be stretched thin trying to provide everything all the time. I feel like some relationships can be supplemented by friendships and less of these shitth divisive family dynamics that force "standing on your own once you're out of the house." Also the "right to womens bodies as property via marriage" has serious echoes of how slave masters were able to rape their slaves, due to them being property. Getting some fine notes of generational trauma still contained in the Black Disapora on that one.

Even in modern ideas of love related marriage, to me marriage altogether is just an agreement to stay the same person. People change, and promising not to change is just an early end in your life. No matter how sure you are of your feelings in a moment, you can't predict the future and, again, people change and there's a lot of shame and guilt in feeling like you have to stay the same person for someone until you die, and even more in failing to do so.

You have such a great perspective about men and masculinity in this video. As a politically active leftist, I see myself advocating much more for the rights of women but it has always been obvious that the patriarchy also limits us men. For us to also learn to deconstruct patriarchy in ourselves instead of just assuming the role of the villain, this needs to be talked about. Thank you, Foreign, means a lot to have this perspective shared and someone fighting for us.

I watched this on Nebula, so I can say that I appreciated that the video highlights the different ways relationships (not just romantic ones) can function. As an aro person with no interest in coupling, I'm especially glad that this was explicitly mentioned.

"they become one flesh" made me wretch for such a sad myriad of reasons 💀

The last line before the YouTube cut ended “disabled people often can’t get married because of health deductibles…” yeah. Also any kind of extreme debt. But not marrying, as far as paperwork is concerned, for frugality opened my wife and me up to seeing just how backward family and friends can be. Just like no one more ants to hear that you have tried everything and are just trying to survive and battle the system for more help, no one wants to hear there’s no “one weird trick!” to get civilly married and not be in a worse spot financially. So many loved ones acted like I said nothing and kept with the same pointed remarks whenever I said “we commit to each other every day. We commit to each other for life. When I proposed it was really just a semi public version of what we had been doing periodically for years. And one day if we decide we want to, we might have a ceremony to commemorate it. But in all the ways that matter, we are married. And we won’t grow lazy in maintaining our relationship because we don’t have some trophies and pictures to let us off the hook for te so that a life long relationship is a life long commitment of effort. Because love is shown, and we’ve shown we will not only stick by but raise each other up through hardships. And I ain’t leaving and I tend to keep doing better and so does she. Ain’t that the entirety of what marriage is supposed to be?” Every time, uncles, cousins, aunts, it was as if they didn’t hear. Cause they just would launch back into whatever point my passionate message just undermined as if I didn’t just undermine it. My Gramma got it though. Was a sign to me how much personal attachment to cultural norms was important to the rest of our two families when no one cared that the supposed paragons and arbiters of tradition approved. People do all that while ignoring that we would t be able to traditionally marry financially for so many reasons if we had wanted to.

This video had me so nervous you were gonna go into some incel shit lol but you gave me a lot to chew on, as a monogamous man planning on getting married in the next couple years. Your story about you and your fiancee encountering a problem, and instantly going into "fix it" mode, totally bypassing the stage where you let yourself feel the effects of what happened, really spoke to me, I do that shit all the time with my partner.

I mean, I think so. Gender roles don't tend to matter as much if at all in queer marriage and atheist and queer people get married. I think marriage is what the couple makes it. Some people won't be able to see marriage without that sort of thing, either because of their own hangups and they LIKE it that way or because it's been associated so much in their minds. But to some people marriage doesn't change the nature of their relationship at all. Edit: also Foreign why you lookin so ticc in dat thumbnail dog 💀💀❤️

Thank you for acknowledging aromanticism and how we're specifically affected by the pressures around partnering. Aro people are almost always left out of conversations about singlehood, queerness, and relationship anarchy, so having you mention us meant a lot. Also, thank you for not confusing us for asexual.